TSS X Steel

Open discussion on Tungsten Super Shot "TSS" Handloading.

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Fishh2o
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TSS X Steel

Postby Fishh2o » Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:29 pm

Im about to load up some duplex loads to start pattering. I have some load data from Hal and will most likely use it. However I'm curious what others are loading. I was going to load either 4X9.5 or 3X9s. I already have #4 steel and have #3s on the way this will be for waterfowl shooting out of a Rob Roberts T1 or T2.



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paulinkansas
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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby paulinkansas » Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:47 pm

I reloaded #3 steel x #9 TSS load last year. I used the recipe from the Alliant website for a Federal GM hull with a Precision Reloading wad and 1 1/8 oz shot going 1425 fps. 1/4 oz of TSS #9 is about 108 pellets and 7/8 oz of steel 3 is 139 pellets. I top it off with a 1/4" felt wad.

Only got to hunt with them once before the season ended. Went 3 for 3 on mallards. Each one was probably dead before they hit the water. I found several of the #9 pellets under the skin on the exit side of the ducks. The birds were more than 40 yards away, but probably less than 50.



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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby Fishh2o » Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:11 pm

paulinkansas wrote:I reloaded #3 steel x #9 TSS load last year. I used the recipe from the Alliant website for a Federal GM hull with a Precision Reloading wad and 1 1/8 oz shot going 1425 fps. 1/4 oz of TSS #9 is about 108 pellets and 7/8 oz of steel 3 is 139 pellets. I top it off with a 1/4" felt wad.

Only got to hunt with them once before the season ended. Went 3 for 3 on mallards. Each one was probably dead before they hit the water. I found several of the #9 pellets under the skin on the exit side of the ducks. The birds were more than 40 yards away, but probably less than 50.


I have been reading Daves in AZ and Hawlips post over on DHC on duplexing and it very informative. Im curious if you loaded TSS below or above the steel?


Roll with it. If you stay above 55 the wheel wont fall off.

paulinkansas
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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby paulinkansas » Fri Apr 08, 2016 6:14 pm

I put the .25 oz of TSS under the steel. It sits in the bottom cup portion of the wad, next to the plastic.

To me, the shot in this part of the wad would be least effected by the choke tube. The wad is thicker, and the petals don't extend all the way to the bottom. I'm also speculating that the shot stays in the bottom cup of the wad for several feet after leaving the barrel. Once the wad slows down from the petals opening, the TSS exits.

There is a 1/8 inch felt spacer on top of the steel, not a 1/4 inch.



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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby Fishh2o » Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:16 pm

Paul,

So I loaded up 8 duplex loads this weekend using the same load data you used. I wanted to go pattern them but couldn't get out i ended up with a hook buried in my hand from a little snook. :oops: So I hope this week i can get a decent portable TSS trap set up and I can pattern next weekend. I loaded 1/4oz #9.5s TSS under 7/8oz #4s to test out. We have an area where we shoot wood ducks at very close rang so the #4s don't really bother me. I want to TSS to ensure they are dead we can have a lot of lost birds if they can still dive. They just go under and grab a hold of something then vegetation is thick in this area its hard to find the dead ones. So they need to be dead when they hit the water.


Roll with it. If you stay above 55 the wheel wont fall off.

iawiley
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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby iawiley » Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:42 am

I just bought some #9.5 tss from hawglips and was planning on loading .25 tss x .75 steel b's and have noticed that nobody seems to load duplex's with the a little bigger steel.... was kinda wondering why? My understanding is this should be close to a ballistic match and would still have 160+ pellets in a 1oz. load, should be a great late season tough ol' mallard and even decoyed goose load but I wonder if i'm missing something?



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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby Fishh2o » Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:16 am

iawiley wrote:I just bought some #9.5 tss from hawglips and was planning on loading .25 tss x .75 steel b's and have noticed that nobody seems to load duplex's with the a little bigger steel.... was kinda wondering why? My understanding is this should be close to a ballistic match and would still have 160+ pellets in a 1oz. load, should be a great late season tough ol' mallard and even decoyed goose load but I wonder if i'm missing something?


I dont think anything is out of the question it all depends on what the situation is. Im loading these up for smaller birds and want the pellet count to be really high. So I know that the #4s should kill out to 25 yard and the TSS out farther. Once I go out to divers and bigger ducks I will probably load #3s and #2s X TSS if i see a good performance out of the duplex loads. If not Im going down to a 20ga all the time and will just shoot TSS.


Roll with it. If you stay above 55 the wheel wont fall off.

Dave in AZ
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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby Dave in AZ » Tue Apr 19, 2016 5:56 pm

The ballistic match for TSS 9.5 loaded into a steel shell going around 1450 is #B steel.
From a MAX RANGE perspective, there is no reason to use smaller steel than #B in a mix, so long as you have sufficient pellet count for your plan.
Here's the basic shell I am using for all my 20ga calculations, where I replace some of the steel shot with TSS:
1oz (437.5gr) of steel; Cheddite 3" 20ga hull; ch209; SAM1 wad; 38gr LilGun; roll crimp.
This is a load tested by "dla" with 11542psi and 1485 fps.

Using KPY for 1000'msl, 32F, 1485 fps
Replacing 1/8oz with tss:

TSS 9.5 duck 65 yds, Steel match is #B steel 63.8 yds (1.5" gel penetration)
Total cost is $0.63 for shot (not counting hull, powder, wad, primer, which cost 0.27 total), total cost $0.90. Of that the TSS is $0.50.
74 steel pellets, 54 TSS, 128 total pellets.

128 pellets is plenty for large ducks which demand 90 only in a pattern.
For 2.25" penetration (geese) you get 39 yards, still a decent load. So, I like #B steel for large ducks and geese, and neither the steel or TSS are giving up any range or compromising the load.

If I want to increase the pellet count, there's no reason to use smaller pellets than needed to get the pellet count needed... doing so just limits the steel penetration portion of the shell. So for 20 ga, if I go to #2 pellets I get ranges of 47 yards still, and a total of 108+54 pellets = 162. This is more than needed for small ducks even (145), although that's an 89% pattern. With an 80% pattern which should be achievable with TSS and #2, you get 130 pellets which is great for med ducks.

By replacing another 1/8oz with TSS, you get an additional 54 tss pellets - 15 steel, so 39 more pellets for a total of 201 pellets. That's a $1.40 total shell that reaches 47 yards and has plenty of pellets for anything.

If you went with #3 shot, you'd have 1.5" penetration to 39.4 yards. In the 7/8oz steel + 1/8oz TSS load you'd have 25 extra pellets vs. #2, so 187 total pellets, for again $0.90 per shell. I just can't see any reason with 20ga or larger to use smaller than #3 steel, 187 pellets is way more than needed, and 39.4 yards is as SHORT a range as I myself could ever accept after putting long-range TSS into a shell...



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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby Fishh2o » Wed Apr 20, 2016 12:35 pm

Dave -- I added your link in our links page

http://www.tungstensupershots.com/page/links


Roll with it. If you stay above 55 the wheel wont fall off.

iawiley
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Re: TSS X Steel

Postby iawiley » Sat May 14, 2016 4:22 pm

Thanks fella's, glad to hear I wasn't missing something. I guess I feel that my regular steel loads for smaller ducks has never given me a problem so never felt I needed tss for them. My problem came in shooting lighter loads (bad back and neck) at late season public ground ducks and getting the pellet count I needed with bigger shot. I do believe I have found my solution though finally! :D




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